On April 19 2011 15:48 DarthXX wrote:

I have started using Ling Infestor too recently, and I love it. Infestors beat VRs, they beat phoenixes, since ur not spending ur gas on anything else (like corruptor roach hydra) you can get a shitton of infestors who really do roll collosi, since you get heaps of NPs to burn. Also transitions nicely into Ultras later in the game if you need to since you will laready have melee attack upgrades for ur lings, or if u choose to go BLs the broodlings are updraded too.

Salazay Germany. April 19 2011 22:09. Posts 1 Joined TL.net Friday, 27th of August 2010

tryed it.



awesome!

On April 19 2011 22:28 Antimage wrote:

This strategy is awesome. coL.Ryze has perfected the ling/infestor opening and transitions.



As a protoss, the best way to combat this is to get 2-3 colossi before taking your third. From there, TURTLEEEEE until you max, and get a few stargates and a dark shrine. You need to be able to deal with whatever transition the zerg chooses - use halluc to keep scouting their army composition. Be ready with VR's against broodlords and archons against zerglings/banelings, with of course more colossi vs roaches. Use ur gas wisely.



As zerg, to help prevent toss from taking their 3rd too easily, get banelings with speed and be ready to engage as soon as they move out into the open.



The last time I matched against him in ladder, the entire map was taken for a 40 minute long epic macro game where army trades happened all game with many tech switches from both players - definitey much more fun than the stagnant roach/hydra/corruptor vs stalker/sentry/colossus war.



PS i'm at work so no rep available =)

On April 20 2011 01:25 Shinrae wrote:

I started doing something similar to this today (before even reading the thread), and havent lost a single game :D



Fungal + Infested Terran spam just cuts through armys like crazy once you get enough infestors (and if sticking to lings, thats a lot of gas for infestors)

In one game I snuck the infesters into their main and watched with a banana grin as the infested terran's cleared out all of their tech in a matter of seconds.



Im sure this wouldn't work half as well in a more respectable league, but down here in Plat im not having any problems at all with getting the numbers I need.

(Although, Ive not come up against a toss yet... But for what its worth, infestors are now my favourite unit :3)

On April 20 2011 05:50 etceteraetcetera wrote:

Lately I've been going ling/roach (if needed) early game into standardish mutaling play midgame to get the econ up and prevent his econ, and as my mutas slowly start to lose their value, anyone who plays mutaling vs protoss knows that point I'm talking about, I start to get infestors out to complement my lings, and i don't think I've lost a single zvp using this where I've gotten to the point where I have about 15 mutas. The rest of the game of keeping their econ stifled with mutas and crushing their army with ling/infestor, brood lord if it goes on long enough, is just ez mode. Sometimes I mix in banelings for fun if I'm at a huge advantage :B

So yeah, this definitely works, I've tried it, and it's a blast, and fungal counters the counter to mutaling, blink, and honestly suiciding mutas to pick off high templar if they make them is the best way to deal with them, and if you successfully get all of his templar even losing all your mutas, you pretty much win.

On April 20 2011 07:24 EternaL_9 wrote:

Add in mass banelings with this and I have NO idea what to do against it.



I used to deal with baneling / baneling drops by using blink / forcefield / sentry micro (FF wall banelings, blink back, micro back / spread colossei.. but now with fungal being used by every master zerg I can't do any micro, I'm calling it broken but that's fine considering that the infestor will probably be nerfed once it becomes more popularized. Forget mass void rays, a few fungals on them and they're dead

On April 20 2011 07:41 Dudemeister wrote:

I do the same thing but I mix in some Hydras and get Ultras afterwards:

http://www.emilj.se/zergvtoss.jpg



Look at his army value!

1300 more gas and 1900 more minerals and I smash him!

I come out ahead with 40 supply of army left. Ling, hydra infestor.

The strength lies in fungal growth. Because the Protoss army clumps up so much, a single fungal can potentially deal ~700 damage



When I get Ultras later I find it really effective to mix in some banes because they just slaughter zealots and forcefields isn't an issue anymore. I do the same thing but I mix in some Hydras and get Ultras afterwards:Look at his army value!1300 more gas and 1900 more minerals and I smash him!I come out ahead with 40 supply of army left. Ling, hydra infestor.The strength lies in fungal growth. Because the Protoss army clumps up so much, a single fungal can potentially deal ~700 damageWhen I get Ultras later I find it really effective to mix in some banes because they just slaughter zealots and forcefields isn't an issue anymore.

On April 20 2011 08:27 Noocta wrote:

Getting 10+ Infestors is ridicously strong for zerg atm. Terrans or protoss can't move out until they have the perfect army.

If they do, they finish crush and zerg only lost lings as keeping infestor alive is way easier than ppl think ( use burrow, don't group all your infestor when you're poking to FG, spell range 9, etc )

It's way more efficient than a baneling heavy army since you don't have to remake them.

On April 20 2011 08:39 MrCon wrote:

Mr Bitter just pwned a protoss deathball on his stream, with this exact build, lings and infestors. The P even had feedback and storm, but it didn't matter, it was a roflstompage. As soon as you have enough infestor to chain 3 or 4 fungals on 2 places at once, and when you neural the colossi, it's just brutal <3

On April 20 2011 08:58 DeltaForce wrote:

yeah omg ive been facing this build online and its brutal *sigh* needs a master toss to come along with a counter to this, but im guessing 4 gate with good ground upgrades with 1-2 stargates massing out phinux? i is a sad protoss player as im just getting back into ladder. oh well, back to laddering yeah omg ive been facing this build online and its brutal*sigh* needs a master toss to come along with a counter to this, but im guessing 4 gate with good ground upgrades with 1-2 stargates massing out phinux?i is a sad protoss player as im just getting back into ladder. oh well, back to laddering

On April 20 2011 09:46 Crescend1 wrote:

I have tested it today in unit tester vs protoss friend. We were both masters. Generally, its viable, and very strong, but every zerg needs alooot of training with this to make it work. This strategy is entirely about positioning/micro. If u mess anything, you get raped in a hardcore way, and u have no chance to come back. If you do it right, battle is even, or u rape Protoss, depending on minor factors. Also, infested terrans are key to this strategy, as fungals dont stack. So after some point, mass energy increase dps of army only with terrans. It's very very tricky strategy, but it's ridiculosuly strong. Also, this must be supplemented with ultras late game, i think that getting collosus to break ff is crazy hard, u need to make good engagement, u need to fungal like 3-4 segments of P army, neural all collosus, reneural collosus if infestors are killed, throw terrans, and not let infestors die if they charge on enemy, or get too close. Microing single collosus to break 6 ffs, is quite hard, and still slow.



And ultra infestor raped most P armies with easy. Thanks for author for this thread, i tried infestors before, but thought they cant work. I guess getting like 15-20 helps alot to turn tides.



PS. Even with collosus count about 5-7 this strategy is viable. We tested it many times, nearly always with armies about 100-120 supply. Also hts doesnt help too much, same goes for archons.

On April 20 2011 11:45 voy wrote:

Here's my replay with that:



This is high platinium, both of us. I should have parasite as well, because I was using parasite with bane drop on the protos 200/200( in antoher game)deathball with voids (with success, i got like 50 larva to remax, he had 1 almost dead colo and 6 stalks left), this game i chosed teching to hive and going ultras instead(toss had blink stalkers). Ultras were late anyway



I see a great deal of potential in this unit composition, on my level of skill (plat/dia) toss is struggling with this. Mass high templar can feedback infestors and hard counter this, but almost never toss is going HT even when he know my unit compo and tech. Here's my replay with that: http://www.mediafire.com/?4rvf08dn6400tas This is high platinium, both of us. I should have parasite as well, because I was using parasite with bane drop on the protos 200/200( in antoher game)deathball with voids (with success, i got like 50 larva to remax, he had 1 almost dead colo and 6 stalks left), this game i chosed teching to hive and going ultras instead(toss had blink stalkers). Ultras were late anywayI see a great deal of potential in this unit composition, on my level of skill (plat/dia) toss is struggling with this. Mass high templar can feedback infestors and hard counter this, but almost never toss is going HT even when he know my unit compo and tech.

On April 20 2011 12:00 Knutzi wrote:

i always knew this day would come... now im gonna have to work to win in pvz : (



this strategy is crazy strong and there is just so much that can be added to it.. baneling drops zergling drops ultralisks to crush forcefields etc etc



i fear that if the really highlevel pro zergs start practicing this instead of clinging to the outdated roach/hydra and corrupter mix zerg will start to crush protoss

On April 20 2011 12:09 Dommk wrote:

Well if anyones watching HuK's stram, CheckPrime is doing this in some way. Roach/Infestor/Ling/Broodlord late game, absoutely crushed a 200/200 3/3/2 upgrade Templar/Colossu/Archon Deathball with the use of Neural Parasite.



Then he switched into Ultra/Ling/Infestor, which he would have won if he didn't sacrifice 8 Ultras/3 Infestors and a bunch of Roach/Ling trying to kill 5 Archons -.-



In other news, Archons with 2 Shield upgrades and 3 attack upgrades are scary

On April 20 2011 15:30 Barrin wrote:

Dude I was saying InfestorLing was awesome since the beta! Some people were intrigued but many disregarded it. But I knew. I KNEW IT WAS BALLER. I knew that in time people would figure it out. I was right.



By the way I just throw in some hydras if they try to go air, works like a charm with fungal growth added in.



I also predict Neural Parasite being used more often against terran but also protoss.



Show nested quote +

good luck zergs, you guys should use moar ultralisks

also this. ultralisks are stronger than people think. Dude I was saying InfestorLing was awesome since the beta! Some people were intrigued but many disregarded it. But I knew. I KNEW IT WAS BALLER. I knew that in time people would figure it out. I was right.By the way I just throw in some hydras if they try to go air, works like a charm with fungal growth added in.I also predict Neural Parasite being used more often against terran but also protoss.also this. ultralisks are stronger than people think.

On April 20 2011 17:45 Dommk wrote:

This is such a pain in the ass especially when after a battle you go for the push but the Zerg is poping nothing but Infestors and you can't make it up the ramp because everytime a fungal wares off two/three more Infestors pop and keep you in place whilst whittling your army down to nothing :/



This + Mass spine crawlers late game gives me head aches <_>



Show nested quote +

Most importantly, from what I've seen in the master/GM leagues, this strategy simply doesn't hold weight on its own. Infestors/lings can be very effective together, given the right situations - saying that it hard-counters the death ball is simply incorrect. :-\



That was what Double forge was like for the first 3-4 Months, it really took a few good players--namely Tyler-- to actually start turning heads.



From what I've played on the ladder this seems to work quite well, especially on HUGE maps. This is such a pain in the ass especially when after a battle you go for the push but the Zerg is poping nothing but Infestors and you can't make it up the ramp because everytime a fungal wares off two/three more Infestors pop and keep you in place whilst whittling your army down to nothing :/This + Mass spine crawlers late game gives me head aches That was what Double forge was like for the first 3-4 Months, it really took a few good players--namely Tyler-- to actually start turning heads.From what I've played on the ladder this seems to work quite well, especially on HUGE maps.

On April 20 2011 18:36 gnutz wrote:

I'm a Protoss player, low master league (after reset, before 3k).



And i think Infestors are highly viable. i faced them a few times.



If you play standard InControl style they are ... unfair. Infestor/Ling demolishes Stalker/Sentry and the 2 Colossus you have when you get your 3rd so badly. It feels worse than getting FFed, because you think you can't get anywhere on the map, no Harrass possible, because everytimeyou move out you lose all your sentries and half of your Stalkers die.

I really need a whole new gameplan against Ling/Infestor, and still i think i will be the one who is the Terran in BW TvZ.



If you go Cruncher Camping Style, yoou do no damage with your air, ifdefended properly. Then you move out against a 3-or-4-Base Zerg. And what happens? Your unkillable "Deathball" with like 10 VRs, 5 Colossi, rest Stalker/Sentry gets DEMOLISHED by Zergling/Ulralisk/Infestor.



After that game i waslike "wtf? did he have anti-air?"



So i can say. It has to be the right way. Infestors are the future and imo now a must-have against Protoss.



As Protoss you now cannot get a Zerg to T3 anymore. You need timings. Really good timings.And if you miss the first, your next timing will get destroyed by Infestors. Without a way to come back.



I fear Infestors. Badly



Keep up good threads !

On April 21 2011 00:15 decaf wrote:

Ive been using infestors to great success lately and I would like to proudly present you 2 late game ZvPs I won with it:

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/166456-1v1-protoss-zerg-backwater-gulch

http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/166457-1v1-protoss-zerg-shakuras-plateau

(backwater gulch is typhon peaks)



You can really turn the tide of any battle, they work insanely well. With NP youre able to be to deal with immortals AND colossi which is a huge advantage over corruptors. I have to experiment more though.

(I'm masters league btw) Ive been using infestors to great success lately and I would like to proudly present you 2 late game ZvPs I won with it:(backwater gulch is typhon peaks)You can really turn the tide of any battle, they work insanely well. With NP youre able to be to deal with immortals AND colossi which is a huge advantage over corruptors. I have to experiment more though.(I'm masters league btw)

On April 21 2011 00:46 Alejandrisha wrote:

I remember the first time I lost my 200/200 deathball to ling/infestor/ultra/baneling drops. It wasn't even close. Fungal combined with baneling bombs on a toss ball is absolutely retarded strong. Think about it. Toss units get exponentially better the more you have and the tighter they are balled up due to forcefield and the surface area of attackers. You exploit that by bling drops (ya if they have blink they only lose 2.25 speed units if they aren't looking... UNLESS YOU FUNGAL 2X AHHHH) and just cleaving the stalkers to death with ultras.. you only need like 1 or 2 to trample forcefields honestly.



Sure, you have to make sure you're not getting 6gated (and baneling bombs can even be out in time for the 6gate push but you have to wait above a cliff since they won't have an obs to see it coming.

On April 21 2011 03:55 Volka wrote:

This is the way to play zvp. I really enjoy the dynamics between Infestor and HT. Screw boring Colossi and Roaches!

On April 21 2011 05:56 phrenzy wrote:

I feel like on Cloud[9] at the moment . I just beat a Master Protoss (not off-race btw) on Metalopolis...Close Positions!!!.... I on the other hand just got into Platinum.



All it took was around 5 or 6 infestors.



And I just got back into Platinum from being demoted to Gold (when I played my placement match in Season 2, which I won) after having a really tough time against toss. And being so frustrated, since getting back in ive played no games on the Platinum ladder and have been doing custom games trying new stuff out.



Very Short Synopsis of the Game



+ Show Spoiler +

After trying to pylon/cannon block me in when i seen he went forge first i noticed something that i guess a lot of players are noticing. Extremely greedy play.



He still went ahead and tried to fast expand, so i made a bunch of lings and shut it down. He tried it again after no warpgate tech (I think). All he had was zealots but then out came the void rays.



After spreading creep right up to his base unchallenged and with the attempted and failed phoenix/void ray harass, i wondered how much of a ground force he had by poking a ling around his natural. There were two Stargates at the front I saw around 8 or 9 void rays.



Im not the greatest player in the world (obviously) and i knew i wouldn't be good enough to hold a third base, but i think i could get it down in the attempt to catch his army off guard and rush his natural. Well... thankfully it work.



I expanded to the far Gold and those 10 or so void rays strolled right over my bitching creep (clumped together in a nice big ball with a ribbon attached) and the 8-9 infestors that i had couldn't scuttle fast enough to lay down the best fungals ive ever landed.



After a flurry of fungals all but two were left.



The biggest grin ive ever had was on my face and after he GG'd, my smile turned into the biggest laugh iv'e had playing this game. (Even though he played really badly)



Ive been really having a tough time just playing the ladder, i know my apm far exceeds Platinum, probably well past low Diamond (with no spamming) but my mechanics I think are on par with my rank.



And as i said earlier, i don't think i would have been able to hold a third, especially the gold (it wouldnt really matter what expansion i took).



But i think i dont really understand the game that much and maybe for a lot of other players. After watching the replay, i think i could have just busted the front and killed him when i shut the expansion down. So it seems wrong that i didnt.



Question



I guess thats another topic, but can one be aggressive with infestors, there is a lot of talk is about using them when you need to... when they push out, can a zerg initiate a battle when they feel comfortable to instead of holding off what comes at them?





I feel like on Cloud[9] at the moment. I just beat a Master Protoss (not off-race btw) on Metalopolis...Close Positions!!!.... I on the other hand just got into Platinum.All it took was around 5 or 6 infestors.And I just got back into Platinum from being demoted to Gold (when I played my placement match in Season 2, which I won) after having a really tough time against toss. And being so frustrated, since getting back in ive played no games on the Platinum ladder and have been doing custom games trying new stuff out.After a flurry of fungals all but two were left.The biggest grin ive ever had was on my face and after he GG'd, my smile turned into the biggest laugh iv'e had playing this game. (Even though he played really badly)Ive been really having a tough time just playing the ladder, i know my apm far exceeds Platinum, probably well past low Diamond (with no spamming) but my mechanics I think are on par with my rank.And as i said earlier, i don't think i would have been able to hold a third, especially the gold (it wouldnt really matter what expansion i took).But i think i dont really understand the game that much and maybe for a lot of other players. After watching the replay, i think i could have just busted the front and killed him when i shut the expansion down. So it seems wrong that i didnt.I guess thats another topic, but can one be aggressive with infestors, there is a lot of talk is about using them when you need to... when they push out, can a zerg initiate a battle when they feel comfortable to instead of holding off what comes at them?

Infested Terrans hard counter Archons